Million moustache march was just one campaign by the Elastic Agency and we discuss why they say "F!!CK the Formula" when it comes to PR.

Jim James (2): 0:00

Welcome to this episode of the UnNoticed Podcast I've got Aaron Perlut who's joining me all the way from Denver and he runs a company called elasticity. Aaron, thank you so much for joining us.

Aaron Perlut: 0:12

Hi, Jim. Thank you so much for having me on today.

Jim James: 0:14

Now tell us about elasticity and the problems that you're solving for business owners.

Aaron Perlut: 0:20

Sure. Yeah, let's just see, was founded about 12 years ago. we were all working for FleishmanHillard, which anyone who works in our industry, Jim is familiar with. And the challenges we're really trying to address is simply that when people come to us. They have a business problem or they wouldn't be coming to us at all. They're trying to drive sales. They're trying to usually it's it's related to their fiduciary responsibilities of whether it's revenues or whether it's a nonprofit that's simply trying to build its cash. Or it's someone in crisis who's trying to protect their revenue because someone is upset with their brand or an individual that represents their brand. Typically that is the problem we're always trying to solve. And the way that we view the world Elasticity is that every problem begins with data. We try to use an infused data with everything. We do try to understand that audience, try to develop creative, try to reach an audience. It's always using data. And today, if you look at reputation management, public relations, advertising, whatever you want to call it. If you look at marketing communications today, there are two primary tenants there's content and there's distribution. And what we try to do is create really compelling and disruptive content and then deliver that. And we remain agnostic to how it's delivered, but typically that delivery needs to be in 360 degrees because getting people to pay attention to one channel today is very challenging. Thanks to what technology has brought upon us over the past 15 years or so.

Jim James (2): 1:54

Aaron, you've mentioned a few things there that are a bit different to your background. You're at FleishmanHillard, the PR firm, so what brought together this this idea of communications and data for sort of a PR background?

Aaron Perlut: 2:11

Yeah, you're right. My my background is really steeped in media relations. I began my career working in television as a producer. And so I have always at the heart of what I'm passionate about and what I'm interested in. It's been content creation. I love creating interesting content, but I spent most of my career in media relations. And I think what we found was that what I found at least, and I don't know this everyone's issue is that Because of the vast changes in media because revenue streams from most media has been sapped. And what you have seen is this revolving door of reporters and and also many media outlets have unfortunately gone under You've had to think about more importantly, what's the most effective channel to reach someone, forget about what your competency is, but let's think about, what really makes an impact. And my, my previous role at FleishmanHillard, I started to see what I was doing was less and less impact. Yes. I was able to get a four or five page story in fortune. But who was really reading fortune magazine. Everything was moving online, nobody. The only magazines were sitting in doctor's offices at the moment. And my partner my, my now partners at elasticy and I had a vision for, starting with data, creating a content, rich, a PR approach. And then integrating that through traditional media relations through social media, through advertising. And we built a team that was integrated and work together because to get back to the data function, if I'm a media relations practitioner, I don't want to be going to 300 different media outlets to pitch my story. When I want to go to is the most effective ones. The person who's got the information for that is actually our media buyers, because our media buyers, they use data that they wouldn't be spending a client's money to place advertising, unless they knew the audience was the most effective for whatever that task is. So the data sharing between our. Paid media and our earned media is makes for a far more effective media relations practice. And then I also find that again, getting back to content, being one of those the fundamental pieces, if I'm able to send a compelling piece of content to a reporter that outlines what I'm trying to get at, they're far more likely to pay attention in the same way that if I've got a short, compelling video on Facebook, you're far more likely to pay attention then to some static post And so that content and the delivery of it is really the two essential stools or I guess pillars the stool.

Jim James: 4:51

.Can you just tell us which tools are you using to do that kind of data targeting and analysis? Because that's where it starts from the sounds of things. Is it Google ad words or what are you using as attribution software?

Aaron Perlut: 5:04

So we could be using, we use a number of things. Some of them proprietary, some of them are simply just paid subscriptions. Everything from Nielsen data to Facebook data, which is free for anyone because Facebook, they don't care about, charging for the data because they want it. They want to charge you for paying to to advertise and reach. I don't mean boosting cause boosting actually, all it does is help reach the audience you've already built. But if you don't use Facebook advertising, you just simply drop a piece of content on there only about 3% of your audience is going to see it. So let's say you're a you're a breakfast cereal brand and and you have a million followers, 3%. If you just drop a piece of content on Facebook, only 3% of your followers are going to see it at most. If you put some spend behind it, that number broadens dramatically and it doesn't have to be a huge spend, but then you're also not just reaching your own audience. You're reaching new audiences and you can segment the targeting data you use to reach them. And when Facebook did that, Everyone followed suit, LinkedIn followed suit, Twitter, followed suit. And what you found was that the platforms are they're tremendous tools to deliver the right message to the right people. But but they're also really great at making themselves money. So if you're not willing to spend a little money, your message is going to fall on deaf ears.

Jim James: 6:24

So does that fundamentally change the nature of PR because it used to be earned media, paid media, it sounds as though all that owned media really is paid for, in terms of distribution, it changes the nature of what PR used to be, which was content that had integrity that was chosen by an editor. Do you think that's just gone away?

Aaron Perlut: 6:47

It hasn't all gone away, but it's dramatically diminished and even. Even the outlets that we think about as still being bastions of earned media, there are still a number of paper play opportunities in them. Forbes has what they call councils and they have the public relations council and they have the advertising council. You can pay $1,200 a year and you can publish on Forbes. So from a thought leadership perspective, that's a very heady thing and it, but it's a pay for play opportunity. It's an advertising opportunity. If you look at native content on say cnn or MSNBC, or what have you oftentimes some of the editorial content we're reading is actually paid for. There's really been a blurring of the lines now. That doesn't mean there are not still credible news opportunities. If you have credible news and I'm there, but oftentimes what media outlets are paying attention to

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 7:47

Uh, actually, no, I, um, I did do give it a listen cause I was curious what

Aaron Perlut: 7:51

The true industry changers, or unfortunately the worst things that are happening in the world.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 7:56

uh,

Aaron Perlut: 7:56

at our news streams, Traditional media is covering

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:01

reached out to me, I actually went and

Aaron Perlut: 8:02

It's from, from the BBC in the UK to, or globally rather to NPR

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:07

apologize for not recalling. Cause it was, it was right when you first out to

Jim James (2): 8:10

the journalists in

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:11

was, so this has probably been

Jim James (2): 8:13

talking with him, he said that know good news is not news. Bad news is good news. And that unfortunately was a tenor of it. you also said something though, Aaron, about

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:22

quite a few. Yes.

Jim James (2): 8:23

for disruptive content. Just tell us what you mean by disruptive content.

Aaron Perlut: 8:29

Yeah. I think when people hear the word disruption, I think there's immediately a negative connotation to it. That means that it's Sasha Baron Cohen, it's buffoonery. It's something like that. And that's not necessarily the case being disruptive is doing something different. And maybe it's not only different for you as a company, but

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:47

Sure. Yeah. The orange was the

Aaron Perlut: 8:49

I'll give you an example of something we've done. For two of our one client, actually on two different

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:54

you know, true to form like, uh,

Aaron Perlut: 8:56

we worked with H and R block, which in the U

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 8:58

aisle, you see recess cause they pop because

Aaron Perlut: 9:00

tax processing

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:02

stood out and I never thought I'd,

Aaron Perlut: 9:03

we worked with them for two different texts, seasons,

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:06

my, my partners 30

Aaron Perlut: 9:07

can go and here's the typical

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:09

FleishmanHillard, anyone who works

Aaron Perlut: 9:11

it's tax season and there's nothing better than H and R block. They process more tax returns than anyone else in the

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:18

some 80, 70, 80 years in

Aaron Perlut: 9:21

that, I'm like, that's not interesting to

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:23

were all senior people there.

Aaron Perlut: 9:25

Slayer is doing with TurboTax. They're doing, they're disrupting the industry. They're making sure you can do it on video. That's disruptive doing on a

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:32

very large ran the digital practice. He

Aaron Perlut: 9:34

for H and R block was called the million

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:36

And then another one of my

Aaron Perlut: 9:38

And we created a we had a tax policy professor write a white

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:43

we saw this as again, 12

Aaron Perlut: 9:44

that basically made

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:45

a real sea change

Aaron Perlut: 9:46

people with mustaches

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:48

and

Aaron Perlut: 9:48

should

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:49

like we see with, uh, with climate deniers today,

Aaron Perlut: 9:52

they were improving good looks in

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:54

uh,

Aaron Perlut: 9:54

And they were erasing the stigma of the ugly

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 9:57

Uh, uh, there was,

Aaron Perlut: 9:59

so we had a tax, we had a true tax policy professor write

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:02

I would

Aaron Perlut: 10:03

It was based on past case study law for

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:06

people didn't really

Aaron Perlut: 10:07

and we held a physical

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:09

they knew. That

Aaron Perlut: 10:12

we launched this in early February until tax day

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:15

but they didn't realize the fundamental impact it

Aaron Perlut: 10:17

The way you could support this was by putting a branded mustache on your photo on Facebook.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:22

an audience.

Aaron Perlut: 10:22

And every time

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:24

I believed in

Aaron Perlut: 10:25

did that, H and R block

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:26

12 years ago we founded elasticy based on the

Aaron Perlut: 10:29

called millions from one which creates water access

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:32

beholden to one

Aaron Perlut: 10:33

But it was this disruptive

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:36

you have to really surround, uh,

Aaron Perlut: 10:39

Taxes related to H and R

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:41

and, um, and deliver a message in 360 so we started, elasticy really

Aaron Perlut: 10:47

And it ended up getting covered globally, not just in the U S the

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:51

and ultimately builds to creating,

Aaron Perlut: 10:53

And it

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 10:54

you have to

Aaron Perlut: 10:55

an actual, to turn a phrase of a drop in the bucket from a, from an investment standpoint and H and R block standpoint, because at the same time they were running their traditional

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 11:04

and that was whole impetus behind

Aaron Perlut: 11:06

This was purely a digital and an

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 11:08

ago with three of us. And today we have,

Aaron Perlut: 11:11

amazing coverage for it, but then we also got great interaction online because it was disruptive because it was different. Nobody took it really seriously. They realized it was all in good fun, but H and R block's name and brand equity was attached to it at every stage of the journey. You can also do disruptive though and tug at the heartstrings. You can do disruptive by. Something that is purely movement oriented. That's trying to drive change to help improve humanity. It's finding a way to, to just step out of the norm.

Jim James: 11:47

That is a really fantastic way of looking at it. I see. You've also worked with GoDaddy, which traditionally is being a, almost a commodity internet registration. Yeah. Can you share another example

Aaron Perlut: 11:58

sure. We were at, we were with GoDaddy at a really interesting time in their evolution as a company because they had become known. As a brand by doing very racy advertising.

Jim James: 12:10

Yeah, exactly. So there's small t-shirts and fairly robust girls.

Aaron Perlut: 12:15

And sprayed down with water after Superbowls or during super bowl. And it was funny because when we signed up with GoDaddy, people said, Oh,

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 12:24

it sounds

Aaron Perlut: 12:25

You guys are crazy. They're crazy. What a great marriage. They hired us actually to help soften their brand. They wanted to appeal to what they call the doers and that is people like us that are

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 12:38

think it's French, but it's actually

Aaron Perlut: 12:39

that need services like web services and different digital services and tools.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 12:45

parents,

Aaron Perlut: 12:46

And so what we really did was we dramatically softened their image and we tried to appeal to entrepreneurs. Not just men sitting at home in their basement and try to use different colors and different scenarios and bring to life different stories about largely oftentimes female entrepreneurs to really

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:09

Jim. Thank you so much for having

Aaron Perlut: 13:10

again, soften the image and appealed directly to people who were gobbling up these different services. And using different tools and creating their own websites

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:22

Sure. Sure. Um, yeah, last us who was founded about 12

Jim James: 13:25

in terms of

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:26

the challenges we're really trying to address

Jim James: 13:28

it sounds like it's also quite

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:30

simply that is when people come to

Jim James: 13:32

kind of

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:33

Um, they have a business problem or they

Jim James: 13:35

Do you have some kind of

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:36

of, of whether it's revenues or whether it's a nonprofit that's simply trying to, to build its cash.

Jim James: 13:44

that they can use.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:45

Uh,

Aaron Perlut: 13:45

Yeah. It's called listening. It's a lot of

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:48

someone is upset with their brand or an individual that

Aaron Perlut: 13:51

own preconceived

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:52

Um,

Aaron Perlut: 13:53

and I've seen

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:54

that is the problem we're always trying to

Aaron Perlut: 13:56

that we go into a situation where

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 13:58

the way that we view the world in the

Aaron Perlut: 14:01

We think we know the answer to something. And instead of stepping back, getting

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:07

we try

Aaron Perlut: 14:08

notions and actually looking at what

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:10

with everything. We do try to

Aaron Perlut: 14:12

then trying to derive insights from

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:14

develop creative, try to, uh,

Aaron Perlut: 14:17

it's not that terribly difficult or expensive to go get

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:19

And today, if you look at reputation management, advertising, whatever you

Aaron Perlut: 14:24

if you don't have those

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:25

If you look at

Aaron Perlut: 14:25

you're a small business owner to look at maybe how your competition is

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:30

and there's distribution. Um, And what

Aaron Perlut: 14:33

Even if it doesn't appeal to your own personal sensibilities, if you're trying to build a business, what you care

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:38

and then

Aaron Perlut: 14:39

an audience.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:40

to how

Aaron Perlut: 14:40

to bring whatever your dream is to fruition, but you're trying to serve a specific

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:45

getting people to pay challenging.

Aaron Perlut: 14:47

I think throwing out those

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 14:48

has brought upon us

Aaron Perlut: 14:49

is where it begins looking at true data and understanding what your audience really wants. I think that to me is the key. And then I think, I think the other thing is this might sound odd paying attention to pop culture. As guys like you and I get older, it's harder and harder. When you hear a name Camilla kumbaya, who is that? She's a really popular singer that my kids love.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:12

You're right. My, um, my background is

Aaron Perlut: 15:15

17 year old girls to sell your products.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:19

television

Aaron Perlut: 15:19

They care. So it's paying

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:21

And so I have always at the heart of what I'm passionate

Aaron Perlut: 15:24

really important because then to get back to the mustache campaign you and I talked about earlier

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:29

um, I spent most of my career in media relations.

Aaron Perlut: 15:32

thing,

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:33

and I think what we found

Aaron Perlut: 15:35

there was this

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:36

what I

Aaron Perlut: 15:36

nature to mustaches and young people everywhere were

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:40

because of the vast changes

Aaron Perlut: 15:42

It was an important part of. How culture was evolving. And today, if you

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:46

most

Aaron Perlut: 15:47

there's a lot more people with facial hair today than there was

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:49

what you have seen is

Aaron Perlut: 15:51

That was

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:51

revolving door of

Aaron Perlut: 15:53

And so we were looking to identify what are

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:56

and also, uh, many media

Aaron Perlut: 15:58

jump on top

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 15:58

unfortunately under, um,

Aaron Perlut: 16:00

for this brand.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:01

you've had to think about

Aaron Perlut: 16:02

Looking at data,

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:03

more importantly, what's the

Aaron Perlut: 16:04

preconceptions out the door and trying to be

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:07

forget about what your competency is, but let's think about, you know,

Aaron Perlut: 16:11

And then thinking about how that ties in possibly to pop

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:15

And, um, my, my previous role at

Aaron Perlut: 16:18

What are the tools that

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:19

I started to see.

Aaron Perlut: 16:20

And not every company like zoom stump, stumbles into a global and be become

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:27

but who was really reading fortune

Aaron Perlut: 16:29

zoom for six years, but there were people

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:30

was moving online, nobody. magazines were sitting

Aaron Perlut: 16:33

before last February. So it's yeah, to me, that's the key it's

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:38

My partner,

Aaron Perlut: 16:38

listening to everything

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:39

partners at Alasta C and I

Aaron Perlut: 16:41

not getting so tied into your own

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:43

you know, starting with data at creating a

Aaron Perlut: 16:44

And

Jim James: 16:45

if people want to listen to you more, Aaron, how

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:47

then integrating that

Aaron Perlut: 16:49

I'd recommend they don't listen to me at all.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:51

through social

Aaron Perlut: 16:52

screaming. The easiest way to find me is to come to our website@goeatelastic.com is

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 16:59

know, to get back

Aaron Perlut: 16:59

our company website. Or you

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:01

I'm going to be, if I'm a media relations

Aaron Perlut: 17:04

find my terrible book, which

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:06

I want to be going

Aaron Perlut: 17:07

But actually. That does get back to an important point that you and I touched on

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:11

is actually our media

Aaron Perlut: 17:12

I should probably

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:12

because our data that they wouldn't be spending a

Aaron Perlut: 17:14

I think that traditionally public relations practitioners

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:17

knew the audience was the most

Aaron Perlut: 17:19

the power of

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:20

whatever that task is. So the data

Aaron Perlut: 17:22

and search algorithms change

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:24

media and media is makes for a far more effective media

Aaron Perlut: 17:28

search is the ultimate

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:29

And then I also find that, um,

Aaron Perlut: 17:31

It helps people find things. It helps people determine whether they want to work for you, whether they

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:36

if I'm able to send

Aaron Perlut: 17:37

somewhere, whether they want to move somewhere, whether they want to purchase a product.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:41

to get

Aaron Perlut: 17:41

And I think

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:42

far likely to pay

Aaron Perlut: 17:43

probably

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:44

in the same way that if I've got a short, compelling video on Facebook, you're

Aaron Perlut: 17:49

relies upon search whether it's Google, YouTube, which is the second largest search

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 17:54

and the

Aaron Perlut: 17:54

in the world being whatever you want, even Amazon has search technology. Facebook has search technology. Search couldn't be more important.

Jim James: 18:04

I agree, and people are going to search for you. They're going to look for your website, Aaron and also going to look for that elastic book that you've got. Thank you so much for joining me. Aaron Perlut rom the elastic business in

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:16

be used. We, we use a number of things. Some of them

Aaron Perlut: 18:18

What an honor. Thank you so

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:19

simply just paid

Jim James: 18:20

You've been listening to

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:21

Um, everything from Nielsen

Jim James: 18:23

Colorado. And thank you for listening to this episode of speak PR.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:26

because Facebook, they don't care

Jim James: 18:27

being disruptive, but not

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:29

charging for the data because they want to, they

Jim James: 18:31

to listen and also

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:32

paying to, uh, advertise

Jim James: 18:34

of search.

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:35

I will say

Jim James: 18:36

to this episode, and we wish you the best of health,

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:40

when Facebook did its IPO six, ago, however

Jim James: 18:43

that if you're going to be

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:43

that's really what that

Jim James: 18:45

do you think about the 360 reputation and all the touch points that anyone has got with your brand? Thank you so much for listening to

audio_only_16780290_Aaron_Perlut: 18:52

you go place a piece

18:53

you have to look very, very carefully to be able to decipher them.