Over 40,000 tenants avoided eviction during COVID with access to this free legal justice.

Mauricio Duarte: 0:00

5 billion people around the world don't have access to justice and when we talk about access to justice is not only access to courts, but it's access to simple legal services. Over 86% of the American population doesn't have access to justice as well. So we have Both the human element and the technology element that helped us to create at least solutions that can make content or legal information accessible and understandable.

Jim James: 0:27

Hello and welcome to this episode of the unnoticed show, or should I be saying,Ola, because I've got Mauricio Duarte joining me. Mauricio thanks for joining me actually from Denver, Colorado, but you're originally from Guatemala. Aren't you?

Mauricio Duarte: 0:40

Yeah. Correct.

Jim James: 0:41

So Mauricio, your a trained lawyer. And you've recently given up all of the, goes with legal life to join a company called access to justice technology, which is a social enterprise that builds technology to improve access to justice, which is amazing. You're on the show to share with us how you've been able to. Start there we'll do the marketing for an enterprise and help the products and the services that this organization is offering to the disenfranchised to get noticed. So can you just tell us more about access to justice and what you're doing for people?

Mauricio Duarte: 1:15

Yeah. so first of all, thank you for the invitation, Jim, as always we were talking in the background, it's always good to meet interesting people with I guess for the podcast community. I have my own podcast. That's in Spanish, but that's not the item here, but going to your question. Access to justice. It's a real, let's say a worldwide problem. It's not a problem. Only in my home country, where I come from Guatemala is not only a problem in the U S it's a worldwide problem. And the first, the say data entry that caught my attention as I was transitioning from a path of becoming a senior associate or a partner at a big offer. It was 5 billion people around the world don't have access to justice and when we talk about access to justice is not only access to courts, but it's access to simple legal services. So sometimes as as attorneys, we have expensive, let's say fees at that store services. So many let's say underserved people cannot access these [Mic bleed] services And access to justice is a very broad term But with that I also focused myself on the U S there was a market that I wanted to start working on and that data showed that over 86% of the American population doesn't have access to justice as well So again even in a market as complex as robust as the us market there's a lot of need For enhancing access to justice And again it's not only access to a judicial court is not only access to an attorney but it comes to access to legal information How can I understand what rights do I have if I'm a tenant if I'm a a mom if I'm at that what are the rights that I have in any type of conflict or issue that my all right So with that we I think together with ADJ tech Yeah he's very focused on how can we provide two different approaches one free solutions that could be leveraged by technology to provide a productized legal services So that means you need a document You need a form you need a And additional let's see item for your legal needs How can you create that by your own Do it yourself We call it DIY through to by yourself using technology And the second item that we started is how can we create if we cannot create a free solution how can we provide solutions or products that could be affordable at a very low rates that can let's say anyone can use So with those efforts I would say the biggest challenge has been Two things One is when you come from the legal industry and you come in an attorney you are used to very sophisticated words talking and speaking And sometimes I'm on myself When I have certain discussions with a practicing attorney can you rephrase that because sometimes we use and I used to do it I used to use it from time to time for instance in landing and very complex words to explain something very easy So instead of saying Oh this is wrong you would say probably you all this is not the best approach to this specific situation Like you're changing the wording to make it more complex But you got to think that at the end of the let's say on the access to justice market the people that you're talking with is not a entrepreneur It's not a businessman is something that someone that probably doesn't have access to internet probably someone that didn't go to college or someone that probably had to drop out of school because of [ Mic bleed] circumstances or maybe someone that they didn't even go to school at all So when you have to translate the legal information So the I would say the wider population it's a real let's say challenge to translate those complex words And even the statues that Congress passes that are have some complex words around it How can you create accessible language for people to understand what rights they have That was the biggest challenge I would say And the second has been Internet even though now we think that internet is a need for everyone around the world There are still people that don't have even access to a desktop to the best of the computer Some of them might have probably very lucky access to a cell phone or maybe even a tablet but we have to stop thinking that everyone has access to internet and our computer So with that sometimes our challenge comes how can we create solutions that can leap off of the grid or of internet to trying to provide more solutions that don't necessarily depend on internet or the internet It's a powerful technology If we cannot create or be innovative enough to create additional solutions that can be offline then we sometimes hit a wall or shortcoming because we are not helping the population that doesn't have access to internet which is a big bigger issue I would say access to justice have a strong and direct correlation with access to internet and access to the internet The data has shown that these are very big issues as well especially during the epidemic So if you don't have internet Sometimes you don't even have access to some of their solutions So that is probably the two biggest challenges that we have on access to justice How can we communicate information and how can we create more solutions that are offline that can have a bigger impact on the population

Jim James: 6:23

so you've bitten off quite a big problem to solve haven't you over 5 billion people According to your website don't have access to legal justice And I see you've got some 70 to 80% of all people who have had some civil Issue arise in their lives It can be a marital one can't It could be a theft it can be an accident any number of things that need attention from maybe legal support So Mauricio you've highlighted two big issues One is about the content One is about the delivery how have you solved you solved then an access to justice the Like the simplification of the content We have this in other spheres of course where in the medical industry or even in technology industries in an attempt to sound like an authority the people who are speaking about these topics use language that distances them from the audience You solve that at access to justice

Mauricio Duarte: 7:19

In my industry And I'm glad that I have now the privilege of working with other professionals So you you work with let's say copywriters that sometimes they get the content from an attorney such as myself I do their research and I try to word it And we try to achieve or strive for a six level reading level which is let's say combining the industry And then sometimes say this is not sixth grade level this year This is probably ninth grade so sometimes working with other professionals and I would say that's the biggest change that I've seen in the legal industry that the now we're working with other professionals with other industries and sending that you can convey information in a simple way But you need other professionals or their experience to see people that can also help Like you don't know everything I don't know Everything sometimes esoteric to me I used to think I know everything but I do not I know certain aspects but I know that other professionals can bring more to the table and bring a lot of value So I would say that is number one And the other thing is that we have technology or use technology and tools that help us just to make sure that we are let's say making the good approach on the wording a specific let's say statutory specifically That makes it understandable again that a sixth grade reading level So we have Both the human element and the technology element that helped us to create at least solutions that can make content or legal information accessible and understandable

Jim James: 8:50

Now then let's talk about the second part which is the technology and the delivery People used to get newspapers for example with notices in them And those are not necessarily appearing on street corners anymore especially in the time of COVID How are you making the documentation and the advice accessible to people that maybe don't have the internet maybe have a mobile device a phone instead for example

Mauricio Duarte: 9:15

[Mic bleed] Correct And and I will tell you the biggest our vision Whenever we create a product or a solution it's always If we're building something don't think that you're building it for a computer Think that you're building it for a mobile phone Number one that is our priority because it's the odds are that people are going to have access to a phone rather than a computer or a laptop So our always our focus is build for mobile first build for that stuff And laptop second but with that mentality and it always comes to let's say [Mic bleed] struggle and it goes a lot of testing for instance saying does it look good at an Android Yeah but it doesn't look good on an iPhone So you got to let's say do a lot of testing and iterations of a prod of a product or a solution only to test If it looks good in mobile And if it's good it looks good in mobile Then we can move to desktop and laptops [Mic bleed] however Other alternatives that we have found in other projects that we've been involved with access to justices Mauricio in jurisdictions in certain States or certain that's a regions of the state and even around the world People don't have a lot of access to even mobile phones So what do we have created or the projects that we have been involved with as creating what we call legal kiosks [Mic bleed] instead of you needing internets you can go to a public library You can go to let's say Governmental office or you can go to places that you would normally walk around and you can access that solution on a legal kiosk Obviously that requires more budgeting and more funding but sometimes Francis the last year though Federal government that the U S health or project on legal kiosks but that's how you can create alternatives that are outside Are you needing a mobile phone or a computer It would only probably require you walking a couple blocks from your nearest library or then the nearest Public office but that's how an alternative that can be provided And you don't need internet because again that that system is embedded on that legal kiosk but are the type of alternative is that we're also looking at when we see that the bigger issue of access to internet is something that can have an impact on how we deliver our products or solutions for access to justice

Jim James: 11:36

That's a really innovative solution and reminds me of some people called Jana gel who are delivering water in a same way through kiosks where the pipes are no longer able to supply fresh water So this idea of delivery in situ at point of need for information as it is for water in certain markets really fascinating Marcio Can you give us an example of a project that access to justice has worked on recently and how that's changed some lives

Mauricio Duarte: 12:07

Yeah I would say the probably they're one of the best And there is some examples on during the pandemic during last year so in the U S just to give a bit of context that's centers for disease control and prevention or what it's called the CDC issued an order That w it was an order to prevent eviction under the scope of this order of last [Mic bleed] any tenants that are living in a housing project we were in an apartment could not get evicted but the only requirement besides meeting some eligibility requirements was filing a declaration letter And that's how it's called to your landlord or [Mic bleed] So you had to create this legal letter that has some legal word being based on the CDC wording and you have to grade it and give it to [Mic bleed] landlord So with that I remembered it was probably September 1st It was late at night when we heard the news that this was coming out we weren't expecting disorder So with the CEO we had a discussion probably I remember it was 6:00 PM late in the afternoon and we say okay we have this could be something really impactful on access to justice If we say that we are at a company focused on access to justice we have to create a solution for this So in 48 hours we brought the whole team together and we say okay Leave everything else on the table If you're working on a project stuff that if you're taking a breaks you have to come back We are investing all of our efforts and resources from the company Again this wasn't financed by a third party of someone else that was financed by the own [Mic bleed] in 48 hours because the order was about to come in September 4th So we had only 48 hours to [Mic bleed] Let's build a solution that came now called COVID-19 eviction [Mic bleed] So without it we created a website We created the tape document automation platform So you can automate the declaration letter to give to your landlord And now that we go back and yesterday we even created a social media post If we go to the organic growth of the solution since it was first launch we are nearing the 40,000 users that have created an eviction letter And with this let's say a simple prototype that again it was in 48 hours It wasn't something that needed angel round financing or sit around findings It's a great something meaningful and impactful We just created in 48 hours But I will say the important thing is was everyone was passionate about this solution Everyone was into it And with that I would say the passion of the project the user could understand or see the passionate that was put in into this platform So with that the organic growth of the solution was amazing I would say we didn't need Google ads We didn't need Facebook ads or we DD need PR statements or let's say the traditional marketing of a solution It was a very organic growth And how it started is we started with our social media If you go back in our posts in Twitter and LinkedIn they're probably the two main platforms that we were very active we started we launched COVID-19 eviction forums English and Spanish And then we added additional languages in Portuguese some and we added a bunch of languages to make it let's say inclusive and multicultural for that platform But as things progressed And as we were looking at October November December we noticed that there was a peaks of traffic in a website And we started wondering why do we have such a lot of interest If we created this out of scratch we haven't given a marketing budget We haven't even and it's a called news media but as we were figuring it out Users were referring or platform to other users but those users at the same time were referring our platform to housing projects or to legal AIDS or to nonprofits that we're tackling [Mic bleed] or we're tackling sorry housing issues So with that We started looking at news I remember reading a newspaper I was mentioning our platform Then what we're featuring in the APA let's say COVID-19 response solutions and like that we started being featured in many platforms but again it wasn't organic [Mic bleed] We didn't need a big budget and marketing We just needed a good impression from the user Which again goes through testing We need to test test and iterate the solution because if they use to cast a good experience so that it goes through UX UI on a technology level if the user has a good experience they're going to refer it to someone else And they probably they know a bunch of colleagues or acquainted as there are need of the same solution So again it was a barrier organic growth and I would say now the CDC order has seen let's say Extended through June 30th, 2021 And we expect hopefully being at 50,000 a bite that they even more but who knows And again it has been a barrier organic growth and that at least for us it was a lesson on if you create a meaningful [Mic bleed] And that it's going to have impact on users and especially on access [Mic bleed] is the industry that we're dealing [Mic bleed] People are gonna need it and people are going to start referring it to someone else Again you not necessarily always if you build something there's this saying that if you build it then they're going to come in It doesn't happen like that always [Mic bleed] if you create something meaningful that is going to have a tangible Positive impact in someone's life They're going to come If they see that their need and you are providing something for free again that was because our specific model people are going to come But again you don't have to think that in order for something to be successful you need big marketing budgets or you need big expenditures on Google ads or hiring a digital agency for let's say leading your efforts It could be a very organic growth into one that was doing the social media was me that I'm not a train a digital marketer I'm not a social media guru I'm just an attorney with some experience on using Twitter Facebook and LinkedIn And I use Hootsuite probably to post the social media at the same time but that's it And I get that's how we seen in many of our other products and solutions have had the same traction on a very organic growth and approach

Jim James: 18:34

Yeah Mauricio is fantastic It's what they call the cascade theory that if you share information that is new and easy to understand that people are more likely to cross the threshold of reservation and to share it with others And that sounds like an absolutely fantastic example of the cascades theory at work and Finally then for access to justice if people want to find out more about the projects and the service is received because you have some documentation automation you have some graphic design you have project management and some bespoke projects as well I believe How can people find out about you

Mauricio Duarte: 19:13

Yeah so to find more about it to A2JTech you can go to our website that is go a2jtech.com Or you can find us on social media on LinkedIn and Twitter Probably the two [Mic bleed] social media that we're active. We are so on Instagram when we're not as active. so you can find us as a2Jtech tech on LinkedIn. And on Instagram and on Twitter, you can find us as goa2jtech. and we are always happy to help, happy to answer questions, happy to collaborate, or even partner up on projects that are in need of solutions for the legal industry.

Jim James: 19:45

Mauricio you yourself have an inspiring story coming from Guatemala and taking up the mantle for for law. And then. Moving across to a a platform where you can serve people with access to justice. So hats off to you, and thanks so much for sharing both an inspiring story from your own life, but also with what you're doing with access to justice. Thank you so much for being on the unnoticed show today.

Mauricio Duarte: 20:09

Thank you, Jim.

Jim James: 20:11

So you've been to Mauricio Duarte who's in Denver, Colorado today. but it's all the way from Guatemala Tookie about really creating products and services that serve a need. And I think the inspiring story around their COVID eviction notice is that if you create a good or service that is readily identifiable and needed, then regardless of the marketing. The consumers will come and take it and they'll share with other people that they know. And that is the cascade theory. So thank you so much for listening to this episode of the unnoticed show. My name is Jim James, and if you like this show, please do subscribe. And in the meantime, we wish you the best of health, a profitable business, and that if you're looking for some legal support, you could check out A2J technology in the States and I'll put their website in the show notes. Thanks so much for listening.